TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

Not a real big deal now but lets try to keep the messages on the right
lists:

for things directly related to research use: research@nuestrosranchos.org

for things of a general nature use: general@nuestrosranchos.org

for things that are announcements use: announce@nuestrosranchos.org

like I said it is not a big deal just a very gentle reminder to lets try
to keep the messages going to the right list.

thanks,

joseph

ps: while I'm at it. Have you all gone in and updated your profiles? If
not log in and go to "My Account" and then the "Edit" tab and completely
as possible (please don't skimp) update your "Personal Information" and
"Research" information. Also while you are there you can change from
individual emails to digest if the list is becomeing to much for your
inbox OR if you really want you can change to "no mail" and not receive
the mail to your inbox at all but will have to read the emails online at
http://nuestrosranchos.org

I have just posted a picture of a church in the Albums/Ranchos y Ciudades/Nochistlan, Zacatecas section. I received this photo from a primo about a year ago and have since lost contact with him. Does anyone recognize this church, and/or know it's name. According to my primo this is where my great-grandparents, Victo Jauregui and Petra Huerta, were married in Nochistlan, Zac.

Olivia,
Rowland Heights, CA

http://genealogy.about.com/od/publishing/a/printing.htm

Joseph,

I had been meaning to ask you about that picture of the men in front of the "Puentes Bros" store.

My husband and I were brought from the Southwest to San Jose as children right after WWII (he from El Paso, age 12, and me from New Mexico's Mesilla Valley, age 8). We lived there, went to school (St. Joseph's, Washington Elementary, Wilson Jr. High, SJ High, SJCC, SJSU), worked there, and retired there before moving up to the Northwest in 1996. Our families in San Jose always bought the corn tortillas at Puentes Bros. since Safeway didn't sell any Mexican products, and I remember my mother would pick up the masa, chiles, etc. for tamales there too.

What a small world. There are several in the group that grew up in what is now called "Silicon Valley". It was so beautiful there after the War, all Victorian houses, Craftsman houses, Spanish style houses, only about 50,000 population, all palm trees and blossoming orchards, the smell from the trees and the canneries that packed the fruits, etc. My folks last lived at 409 N. 18th Street, corner of Washington, I think.

I also lost a fingertip (middle) when I was a child of five in New Mexico. It got lopped off when a heavy wooden door I was going through slammed shut suddenly behind me while I was still holding onto its edge. My aunt later found the finger tip. I will have to ask her what she did with it. (She's 92 now). I remember I was in such pain for weeks that my whole left side was paralyzed, and I had to wear a sling to hold my arm up later. It took so long to heal; all they did was bandage it with gauze. OOOh. That finger is more than a quarter inch shorter than the corresponding one on the right hand.

Emilie Garcia
Port Orchard, WA ---

There have been quite a few new members that have joined the list since
we moved to the new site.

If you haven't had a chance yet please do introduce your self on the
Research list: research@nuestrosranchos.org

Make sure to give us the Surnames in the specific areas within our
Target area of research that you are researching. If you have any
questions or want to make comments please feel free to do so on whatever
list would be appropriate:

(for General topics)
general@nuestrosranchos.org

(for Announcements)
announce@nuestrosranchos.org

(for Research topics)
research@nuestrosranchos.org

thanks,
joseph

ps: I sent this "Announcement" message to the Research List because I think Introductions should be sent to the Research list since they specifically will include
Surnames and areas of Research. Don't be intimidated if you can't figure out which list to mail your comments to. There won't be a "proper forum" officer ready
to pounce on you if you post to the wrong list. For those that want to help redirect messages to an appropriate list just change the address sent to the group before
clicking on "reply."

I've run across a surname that does not comply with the traditional Mexican progression of surnames. In other words, the name of the person is not followed by the surname of the father, then the surname of the mother.

Instead, the name of the child is followed by the entire name, first name and surname, of the father.

The surname is Marcelo, also spelled Marselo.

The person in my tree is Salvador Marselo. Or Salvdr. Marcelo. Born around 1793.

I think Marcelino could be a variant of this surname.

I examined a wide range of Marcelos in familysearch, and this pattern holds up across Mexico, and across the centuries.

For instance, Maria, daughter of Juan Marcelo and Maria Gonzales, would be Maria Juan Marcelo.

And even more oddly, Juan, son of Marcos Marcelo and Juanita Verdugo, would be named Juan Marcos Marcelo.

This seems to run contrary to all other nomenclature.

The surname sounds of French, or possibly Italian origin to me. I don't know if that would have any bearing, or if other surnames might use this construction.

It certainly complicates searches.

It could be a holdover from a previous system of naming children.

if you saw a little boy running around the store sometimes then it might
have been me. Then again it could easily have been one of my many
cousins. You never know but you and I might have met or as little kids
looked at each other way long ago.

Joseph,

Who knows, maybe all 3 children played together, YOU, Me and John Gonzales at Puentes Brothers store and tortilla factory. John Gonzales lived by Alum Rock, you lived in the middle on 18th street and I lived on the other side in what is called the Burbank district, close to highway 17 and 280. I went to Del Mar High School of the Campbell high school district. John went to James Lick and I don't know what school you went to. Maybe Karma or our ancestors brought us together.

Sorry to hear that you lost part of your finger but since it did happen you will always have that story to recount. Thanks for sharing your photos and stories, goes to show we are more than just names, we are people with family histories and a lifetime of memories that are waiting to be told.

Alicia

Arturo,

I just noticed that Linda's messages regarding her new DNA test results
aren't listed in the Ranchos website.

Previously I also noted that one of my posts apparently was truncated on the
way from my email client to the Ranchos website.

Just wanted to bring this to your attention so you can check if there's
something wrong and if there are any other instances where this is
happening.

Saludos,

Victor

"Mongolian blue spots are common among darker-skinned races, such as
Asian, East Indian, and African. They are flat, pigmented lesions with
unclear borders and irregular shape. They appear commonly at the base
of the spine, on the buttocks and back. They may also can appear as
high as the shoulders and elsewhere. Mongolian spots are benign skin
markings and are not associated with any conditions or illnesses."
[p://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/001472.htm]

http://blip.tv/file/15484

this one is full of relatives from Jalisco, Zacatecas and Chihuahua

joseph

ps: you'll have to have Windows Media Player to view. . .sorry Mac folks,

but if you have QuickTime you can try this: http://blip.tv/file/15482,
but when I checked it the audio wasn't working and the picture was
incredibly small.

Linda with DNA the geographical areas are easier to cross and still make connections. A great
database has already been set up and it would be good to make your contributions there on
Gary Felix' site.

See: The Genealogy of Mexico
http://members.tripod.com/~GaryFelix/index63.htm

For genealogical purposes "I Think" that the main use of DNA is to compare your Y-DNA with others
that have the same last name to see if they compare. Others that are more fluent on DNA results can
more likely give a better explanation.

joseph

-------- Original Message -------- DNA
Date:Wed, 05 Jul 2006 07:34:42 -0500
From: Linda R Romero
Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org

Will "Ranchos" set up a place in its files for us to upload and
compare our DNA results? It may be helpful for us to be able to
compare our DNA with one another. It's another dimension of
research that compliments the gedcoms already in
the files.LindaROMERO Y-DNA Surname Group Co-Administrator
http://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/r/romero/
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/romero

In reference to Chinese immigrants in Mexico prior to 1650... one of the most Mexican of traditions originates with an Asian immigrant...

http://www.houstonculture.org/mexico/lachina.html

ASIAN INFLUENCE IN MEXICO STEMS FROM SEVENTEENTH CENTURY
By Mark D. Lacy

La China Poblana has a special place in the hearts of Mexican people who revere Puebla, ranking just below Mexico's freedom and above delicious food as a symbol of Puebla's proud history. Puebla is know to the world as the city where Mexico defeated the French on May 5, 1862 to eventually win its second independence. For Mexican people, Puebla is known as a great place to enjoy delicious varieties of mole poblano (sauces made with chocolate and spices usually poured over chicken) and chiles enogada, (poblano peppers that are covered with red and white sauces to resemble the flag of Mexico).

But for people all over Mexico and audiences throughout the world, the tradition of La China Poblana is seen on the brightly embroidered ballet folklorico dress style from Puebla, thought to be Chinese in its influence.

La China Poblana, an Asian woman who lived in Puebla, came to Mexico in 1620 as a servant and left her mark on the traditions of the Spanish colonial region with her clothing.

The girl who came to Mexico in the early seventeenth century was probably sold into servitude by traders in the port of Acapulco. She is believed to have been captured by South Seas pirates when she was nine. Evidence indicates she was named Mirrha and came from India, through Spanish controlled ports in the Philippines.

Mirrha (La China Poblana) is believed to have been bought by Miguel de Sosa, who baptized the eleven-year-old "Chinese girl" and gave her the Christian name Catarina de San Juan. After Sosa and his wife died, Catarina married Domingo Suárez, the Chinese servant of a local priest, adding to the legend that she was Chinese.

The dress style now known as China Poblana, a white blouse and colorful embroidered red and green shirt, has evolved to include the national symbols of Mexico - an eagle clutching a snake, and prickly pair cactus. A woman who wears the dress usually braids her hair on two sides, tied with red, white and green ribbons.

HI,

I am a new member to Nuestros Ranchos and already I made contact with a distant Tisnado relative. Based on the IGI found in www.FamilySearch.com, migration and settlement patterns, I am searching for the Tisnado ancestor who migrated from Jalisco to Sonora.

To date, the earliest Sonora record I have found is the marriage of Jose Domingo Tisnado and Ma(g)dalena Contreras on August 28, 1736.

Surnames I am searching: Tisnado, Lisarraga, Monreal, Tapia, Sesma and ,of course, Martinez.

Thanks for your consideration.

Most of my research originated in Calvillo and Aguascalientes,
Aguascalientes. This is my fathers paternal side. My surname is Gonzales,
below is my father Antonly Richard Gonzales. The following are two pages of
my book in dictionary form of surnames I've researched from LDS films and
other documents.

Rose Hardy

Gonzales, Anthony Richard
The son of Antonio Ramon Gonzales and Agnes Jesse Ruelas. He was also known
as Sonny to family and family friends and also went by the name of Richard
until his death. He was born on 3 April 1938 in Covina, California. He
married Mary Louise Rios, the daughter of Ernest Rios and Francisca
Hernandez on 15 November 1958 in Azusa, California. The witnesses were
Anthony N. Ruelas and Terry Villegas. He lived in Azusa until his death on
11 January 1979. He was buried at Queen of Heaven Cemetery in Rowland
Heights, California on 15 January 1979.

Gonzales, Antonia
The daughter of Salvador Gonzales and Catharina Ramirez. She married Juan de
Santos, the son of Matheo de Santos and Theodora Chaves on 7 January 1704 in
Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes. The witnesses were Antonio Bedoya and
Antonio Sagrado. She was buried on 6 July 1764 in Aguascalientes,
Aguascalientes.

Gonzales, Antonia
The daughter of Juan Gonzales Hidalgo and Cathalina Gonzales. She was
baptized 27 June 1683 in Teocaltiche, Jalisco. The godparents were Joseph de
Albares and Juana de Billagran.

Gonzales, Antonio
The son of Jose Sesario de la Trinidad Gonzales and Decideria Pompa. He
married Anacleta Ramires, the daughter of Damaso Ramires and Victoriana
Gonzales on 3 May 1865 in Calvillo, Aguascalientes. The godparents were
Felipe Calvillo and Refugio Rodrigues. The witnesses were Ysavel Mendes and
Perfecto Ruiz.

Gonzales, Antonio
The son of Luis Gonzales and Cathalina de Quiroga. He was baptized 7
December 1648 in Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes. The godparents were Juan
Macias and Margarita Gonsales.

Gonzales, Antonio Julian
The son of Manuel Gonzales and Ines Delgadillo. He was born 31 January 1733.
He was baptized on 15 February 1733 in Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes. He
married Maria Micaela de la Carmen Gutierrez, the daughter of Joseph
Benancio Gutierrez and Francisca Xaviera Macias on 2 February 1761 in
Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes.

Thank you, that answered my questions. I am trying to learn. Helen
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: arturoramos
>
> Helen:
>
> The films database on Nuestros Ranchos has two basic functions... the first is
> to make it easier to search IGI and VRI by providing batch numbers by
> municipality and date so that you can easily narrow your search and even perform
> powerful wildcard searches that are usually not possible without batch numbers.
> In fact, when you find a film in the database, you can simply click the IGI or
> VRI button next to the film number and it will take you directly to the
> familysearch website and give you a listing of EVERYTHING that is on that film
> from which you can narrow your search by entering as little or as much
> additional data as you want.
>
> The second purpose is so that members can see if another member has a particular
> film on indefinite loan at their local FHC. Members who have films on such
> indefinte loan are usually familiar with the content of the film and can answer
> questions and some very generous ones will even do a sporadic lookup for another
> member so as to facilitate searches...
>
> I hope this helps.

I've standardized all my spellings to conform to today's language.

At first I left the old names, they are quaint and add a certain flavor to my tree.

But my tree is too large and unwieldly for that now. Too many alternate names cause confusion and chaos.

Remember that Spanish has even changed alphabets (the Latin alphabet it utilizes today, the Arabic alphabet it used during the Moslem occupation of Iberia, and even the Hebrew alphabet)and still retained its integrity.

But you wouldn't retain a name in the original Arabic if you found a record of yours in that language.

The data has to remain accesible to the broadest possible audience. Most modern readers would not be familiar with old spellings. It would distract from the main thrust of our interest, in my opinion.

Actually, I found five individuals whom I believe are siblings for Yolanda's grandmother, Maria Ruano. There may be more, but the IGI database for Nochistlan only goes up to 1875. Unless the microfilms for the years after 1875 are indexed, it will necessitate going through them entry by entry to find any others.

JOSE JUAN RUANO ULLOA -- IGI Batch # J606251 -- Film # 0226673
Parents: CANUTO RUANO -- MARIA LADISLAO ULLOA
Christening: 28 Dec 1867 Nochstlan, Zacatecas, Mexico

MARIA FELIPA RUANO ULLOA -- IGI Batch # C606252 -- Film # 0226674
Parents: CANUTO RUANO -- MARIA ULLOA
Christening: 2 May 1869 Nochstlan, Zacatecas, Mexico

JOSE SEVERIANO RUANO ULLOA -- IGI Batch # J606253 -- Film # 0226675
Parents: CANUTO RUANO -- MARIA ULLOA
Christening: 28 Aug 1871 Nochstlan, Zacatecas, Mexico

JOSE PEDRO RUANO ULLOA -- IGI Batch # J606253 -- Film # 0226675
Parents: CANUTO RUANO -- MARIA ULLOA
Christening: 20 Oct 1872 Nochstlan, Zacatecas, Mexico

MA. TORIBIA RUANO ULLOA -- IGI Batch # C606254 -- Film # 0226676
Parents: CANUTO RUANO -- MARIA ULLOA
Christening: 18 Apr 1875 Nochstlan, Zacatecas, Mexico

~Deena~

P.S. And yes, Charles Clark and Pat Corbera's husband are related about two dozen ways although I think the closest relationship is 4th cousins 1 time removed.

I am trying to trace my de la Torre's in and around Guadalajara and
Tepatitlan de Morelos. What I know is Jose de la Torre and Elena
Romero had at least four children: Sofia (b. ca. 1881), Adolfo,
Leopold, and Beatriz. I have photos of Beatriz and Adolfo. Sofia de
la Torre married Castulo Romero around 1900/1904 and had four
children: Rosendo, b. 1904; Salvador, b . 1906; Ramon, b. 1907; and
Elena, b. 1910. Is there any trace of this de la Torre family in
your records? Rosendo, Ramon, and Elena immigrated to the U.S. in
the early 1920's.

Linda

ROMERO Y-DNA Surname Group Co-Administrator
http://www.worldfamilies.net/surnames/r/romero/
http://www.familytreedna.com/public/romero

Thank you so much for your help. Helen
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: arturoramos
>
> Helen:
>
> It appears someone at LDS is researching your family as well, since there are a
> number of entries of your ancestors in the IGI that indicate they were submitted
> by an LDS member. Is it you by any chance?
>
> Here is your grandfather's marriage. It appears your grandfather was named
> after his gandfather:
>
> Hermenegildo Femat
> Parents:
> Father: Tiburcio Femat Family
> Mother: Simona Richarte
> Marriages:
> Spouse: Antonia Montanez Family
> Marriage: 1874 San Francisco,De Los Romo, , Aguascalientes, Mexico
>
>

I would like to research the Femat, Montanez,Reyes, Perez, and Richarte surnames. Helen Femat Fisher

Emilie Garcia's GARCIA-CERVANTES and OLAGUE-TINAJERO [FELIX] trees are now in the GEDCOM database. These trees are also available on Ancestry.com but now they are searchable from within the Nuestros Ranchos site along with over a dozen other members' trees.

You can search her trees specifically by clicking on the GECOM menu item, then clicking on the "Surnames" link in the page that comes up and choosing "Garcia, Emilie Ancestors" from the pull-down menu labeled "Tree".

Los arboles GARCIA-CERVANTES y OLAGUE-TINAERJO (FELIX) estan disponibles el la base de datos GEDCOM. Estos arboles tambien quedan disponibles en Ancestry.com pero ahora se pueden buscar y revisar desde dentro del sitio Nuestros Ranchos con mas de una dozena de arboles de otros miembros.

Puedes revisar sus arboles especificamente haciendo click a la seleccion GEDCOM desde el menu principal, luego haciendo click en el vinculo que lee "Apellidos" en la pagina que aparece y luego escogiendo "Garcia, Emilie Ancestors" desde el menu extendible que con la etiqueta que lee "Arbol".

Isn't that you, Joseph, and Figen, in photo #18? I
hope you had a good time while in DC, and didn't get
caught in that sudden gully-washer of a storm that we
had on the afternoon of the 4th.
Regards,
Natalie Coleman

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

Here are the pictures of the Texas Connection to the American Revolution
Associations' DC parade float on July 4th, 2006. If anyone wants to save
any of the pictures they will be online through July but will be removed
sometime in August. To save just right click on the any URL below and
pick "Save Link Target As" and then pick the place on your hardrive you
want to save the photos. If you have any trouble let me know.

thanks,

joseph

ps: Jack Cowan (Tcarahq@aol.com) will be able to properly supply the
names of the people in the pictures.

<<<"......I've standardized all my spellings to conform to today's language.
At first I left the old names, they are quaint and add a certain flavor to my tree.
But my tree is too large and unwieldly for that now.........">>>

Long ago I stopped entering the exact name written on church or legal records,
there were simply too many variations. Even some priests spelled their names
three different ways on the same record.

So like Ernie and Alicia and others with large data bases, I started standardizing
all my surnames and keeping the original spelling in the notes - but quickly ran into
even more of a problem. With thousands of surnames over a span of 400 years,
it was very difficult to quickly pick out the individual I was researching, especially
when sharing information with someone else.

Now what I do is a kind of trick entry: if there are 100 Joses with the same basic
surname, the Joses born in the 1800's or later are entered as Jose; the ones born
in the 1700's are entered as Joseph; the ones born in the 1600's as Jocephe. For
women, Josefa for 1800's or later, Josepha for pre 1800's, or Getrudis for one
century, and Xetrudis for another. With this way of entering names, I can still keep
something of the 'original flavor', as Ernie says, and also at a glance I can tell in
which century the individuals were born, as those born in the same century will be
grouped together. Same with the surnames: LOPEZ is for the ones born after 1800;
LOPES for the ones before 1800. CALVILLO for those born after 1800, CALBILLO for
1700's. BASQUES for 1600's, VASQUES for 1700's, VASQUEZ for 1800's.

Gloria Delgado

Help:

Does anybody out there knows an easy way to find a member's E-mail address so he (she) can be contacted directly?

I sure miss the "who is who" members directory from the old site...

Thank you.

John Gonzalez
Wildomar, CA.