TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

Excellent Calavera.  How cool is that. 

Muy bien dicho!

Irma

---

From: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joseph
Puentes
Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2005 12:39 AM
To:
ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject

Glo,

Here is some information:

Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Guadalupe_Hildalgo

Maps:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:National-atlas-territorial-
acquisitions.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Territorial-acquisition-uscensus-
bureau.jpg

If the links wrap be sure to recreate in address bar.

- Angie


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "glo Sandoval-Fuentes" 
 wrote:
>
> I would like to hear further on this because I always thought that 
Mexico 
> did own California too, like till the beginning of the 1900's?
> 
> 
> 
>                ~~glo~~
> 

I would like to hear further on this because I always thought that Mexico
did own California too, like till the beginning of the 1900's?

              ~~glo~~







From: "Edward Serros" 
Reply-To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [ranchos] Re: Mexican Border
Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2005 16:32:03 -0000

Angie,

As a point of clarification, the independent country of Mexico owned much of
the
Southwest for only a few decades (1810/1820 time frame to ~1848). Spain
owned the
Southwest for centuries. The only reason I bring this up is that I hear the
statement that
Mexico owned California all the time and I am not sure people remember the
dates well or

fully understand the entities involved.


Ed

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "aajay1073"  wrote:
>
> Emilie,
>
> Just wanted to comment on what you wrote below...I once heard someone
> with a similar experience as your sister...  There response was "I
> didn't cross the border it

Steven,

As an FYI... the Census was posted in the file section and is also 
available in the link section.  As a note, the census doesn't give 
any specific information on families just on landowners/head of 
household.

I too am following the Miramontes Family from Tlaltenango.  Just 
wondering if you want to exchange some info...

Thanks,
Angie


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Steven F. Hernández" 
 wrote:
>
> I have not checked my email in a very long time, but this email 
caught my
> eye right away.  Lorenzo de Miramontes is my ancestor so I am 
interested if
> it mentions any of his immediate family, as well as the family of 
his
> brothers, sisters, and/or his parents and other children.  
> 
> How would you send such a document?  Would it be a computer file or 
the
> actual copy of the original manuscript?  I will pay you good 
moneyyou're
> your trouble.  Please send it to my email address:
> 
> PacoHernandez73@m...
> 
> I now use this address way more than

Ed,

Sorry...I have a tendecy to simplfy things and generalize...  I fully 
understand what you mean.

Thanks,
Angie

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Edward Serros"  wrote:
>
> Angie,
> 
> As a point of clarification, the independent country of Mexico 
owned much of the 
> Southwest for only a few decades (1810/1820 time frame to ~1848). 
Spain owned the 
> Southwest for centuries. The only reason I bring this up is that I 
hear the statement that 
> Mexico owned California all the time and I am not sure people 
remember the dates well or 
> fully understand the entities involved.
> 
> 
> Ed
>

Angie,

As a point of clarification, the independent country of Mexico owned much of the 
Southwest for only a few decades (1810/1820 time frame to ~1848). Spain owned the 
Southwest for centuries. The only reason I bring this up is that I hear the statement that 
Mexico owned California all the time and I am not sure people remember the dates well or 
fully understand the entities involved.


Ed

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "aajay1073"  wrote:
>
> Emilie,
> 
> Just wanted to comment on what you wrote below...I once heard someone 
> with a similar experience as your sister...  There response was "I 
> didn't cross the border it crossed me!"
> 
> Here in Southern California...even though almost all the cities and 
> streets are in Español.  People seem to forget that Mexico use to own 
> all of the Southwest States.  And even though the border was moved to 
> its current location, many of the people stayed.
> 
> As for me, I have been able to successfully trace most

Great Stories Elvira. . .i didn't know about the "No Pago" records but just had a feeling that there were and continue to be an assortment of records in each parish that have not been microfilmed and have not been made available to the general public. Your stories show this is true. Thanks for sharing and keep your accounts coming.

If you ever want to get some of your families oral history recorded and up on my podcast let me know. This

Excellent Calavera.  How cool is that. 

Muy bien dicho!

Irma

---

From: ranchos@yahoogroups.com [mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Puentes
Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2005 12:39 AM
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ranchos] CALAVERA POEMS

forgive me. . .I meant to reply the same day but decided to wait and
then promptly forgot.

wow! you make me feel like a god. . .how many can say they've had poety
written for them. I'm sure this will make my wife jealous, I can wait to
tell her!

Thank you Yolanda, what a nice thought and yes I do believe I'm getting
help from my primos, tios, tias, etc.

muchisimas

Joseph:



You can move me if you want...I need to do a better job of listing my family tree anyway!



Mickey

Joseph:



I go for "fair but restrict'.....we can also join Jonathan's group.



Mickey

forgive me. . .I meant to reply the same day but decided to wait
and
then promptly forgot.

wow! you make me feel like a god. . .how
many can say they've had poety
written for them. I'm sure this will make my
wife jealous, I can wait to
tell her!

Thank you Yolanda, what a nice
thought and yes I do believe I'm getting
help from my primos, tios, tias,
etc.

muchisimas,

joseph


Yolanda Medina-Perez
wrote:

>A tradition in Mexico is the writing of a CALAVERA for

>friends,family, public personalities and politicians.  Calaveras
are
>meant to be funny, they are not meant as eulogies, but are mild

>teasing.  There's usually some sort of rhyme, and they can be

>several lines to several stanzas in length.  They can also be poems

>of

Hi, there! I am descended from the Zaldivars you've mentioned below. However, my PROVEN descent from them does not carry forward the Zaldivar surname. My great-grandmother was Francisca Saldivar, d/o Geronimo Saldivar and Petra Gomez; Geronimo Saldivar was the s/o Narciso Saldivar and Maria Antonia Morillo. (It's through Maria Antonia's mother, Juliana del Carmen Villavicencio that my family descends from the Zaldivars mentioned in your note to me.) Narciso was the s/o of Juan Josef Zesario Saldivar and Antonia Rossalia de Llamas; and Juan was the s/o Joseph Saldivar b. around 1700 in Zacatecas and his second wife Maria de la Luz Ortis. Joseph's my Zaldivar brick wall. I don't know anything more about him other than he had sons with his first wife. Sincerely, Marge Vallazza:)



On Nov 8, 2005, at 9:36 AM, José Román González López wrote:

Hi Margarita:

 

In the Coahuila-Nuevo Leon area, there are multiples families that have as your ancestors the "Zaldívar" from Zacatecas. In my

No. But I'm planning to research my ancestors from
Panuco this month.  If I do find any Zaldivars, I'll
let you know.

Albert Duarte Prieto
Santa Maria, California

--- Margarita Vallazza  wrote:

> Do you have any Zaldivars in your Panuco ancestry? 
> Marge:)
> On Nov 7, 2005, at 5:45 PM, Alberto Duarte wrote:
> 
> >
> >  How do you expect Americans to know the history
> of
> >  another country or group when they know very
> little
> >  about their own history?  If you don't believe
> me,
> >  just ask them. 
> >
> >  Emile, you are doing way better than me.  I can
> only
> >  trace my ancestors back to 1675 in Panuco,
> Zacatecas.
> >
> >  Alberto Duarte Prieto
> >  Santa Maria, California
> >
> >  --- Emilie Garcia 
> wrote:
> >
> >  > Yes, Arturo,
> >  >
> >  > It is so frustrating to know that Anglos here
> don't
> >  > have a clue about our history.  They are
> amazed when
> >  > I request records for 1640, or mention that I
> just
> >  >

Emilie,

Just wanted to comment on what you wrote below...I once heard someone 
with a similar experience as your sister...  There response was "I 
didn't cross the border it crossed me!"

Here in Southern California...even though almost all the cities and 
streets are in Español.  People seem to forget that Mexico use to own 
all of the Southwest States.  And even though the border was moved to 
its current location, many of the people stayed.

As for me, I have been able to successfully trace most of my family 
ancestors to the 1700's in Colotlan and Totatiche, Jalisco.  I have 
hit some brick walls but I am currently trying different angles.  My 
fahter did cross the border, he came to the U.S. in the 1950's during 
the Bracero program.

Angie Godina
So. California


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia"  
wrote:
>My sister (born in Colorado as I was) once was told by her boss at 
work, "Well, Alicia, now that you have adopted this country as your 
own

There is a 1785 Census of the Colotlan region that is held at the
Archives of Simanca in Spain and has bee digitized.

I was thinking that perhaps we could get a few volunteers from the
group to help transcribe it and then perhaps even publish it.  I think
it would be very useful for many people in the group and as far as I
know, it has not previously been published.

The document can be found on Archivos Espanoles en Red at:

ES.47161.AGS/19.8//SGU,7015,2

Let me know if you are interested in helping out on this project.

There is a 1785 Census of the Colotlan region that is held at the 
Archives of Simanca in Spain and has bee digitized.

I was thinking that perhaps we could get a few volunteers from the 
group to help transcribe it and then perhaps even publish it.  I think 
it would be very useful for many people in the group and as far as I 
know, it has not previously been published.

The document can be found on Archivos Espanoles en Red at:

ES.47161.AGS/19.8//SGU,7015,2

Let me know if you are interested in helping out on this project.

Josie:

If I remember correctly, Estaban Valdes Salazar's family in Totatiche 
are relative newcomers since their ancestor only immigrated to the area 
from Spain in the mid-1700s.  There is actually an older Valdes line in 
the area who were originally "Llanos y Valdes" that goes way back... 
one of the first families to settle in Jerez, Zacatecas in the 1500s 
and then a branch moved to what is now Villa Guerrero to resettle the 
main hacienda there after one of the many indigenous uprisings that had 
led it to be abandoned.  That family is very prominent... lots of army 
officers and to date about half of the mayors of Villa Guerrero are 
Valdeses from this line.


>>Hi Arturo! I just now had time to try to catch up on my e-mail (Mickey
Garcia and I were in Monclova, MX  for a few days) and just read the 
above message you sent a few weeks ago.  You mention that you are going 
to try to interview Esteban Valdes Salazar while you are in Mexico 
during December and January.  I am