TEST SITE - DO NOT USE - Development only

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "John Gonzalez" 1gnzlz@v...> wrote:
>   > I remember seen a definition of cerro as backbone, or espinazo. 
>   Cerros means a small mountain.  It goes: Loma, cerro, montaña y
>   sierra, degrees according to size. > 

John, 

Using the Mormon data and the Archivos en Red, I have tracked back at least on person 
with del Cerro surname to Lanestosa, Spain which is in the Basque Country. If you use 
Google Earth and type in Lanestosa, Spain you will get a good idea how the last name 
might have arisen since the area is very mountainous, as is Northern Spain in general.

In my investigation of the Cerro/Cerros surname it appears that there may be at least two 
Cerro/Cerros groups, one in Zacatecas and one in Jalisco. The Zacatecas group is centered 
around Pánuco and goes back centuries. Many of the Cerro males clearly marry women 
with Basque surnames as one reviews the IGI data. Don Juan de Oñate, a Basque, was from 
Pánuco. He "discovered" El Paso on his

Marge,

I have a copy of a map of Aguas. from 1943 showing Santiago located
almost directly south of Rincon de Romos and Pabellon, almost
directly east of San Jose de Gracia, and northwest of San Francisco
de los Romos.
(Carta General del Estado de Aguas., 5 May 1943, Mapas de México,
Aguas., Colección Geográfica Patria)

Also, in Beatriz Rojas' book, "Las Instituciones de Gobierno
y la Elite Local", there are actually two haciendas listed by
that name. She lists one in a chart called "Las grandes haciendas
y sus dueños a fines del siglo XVII", showing the proprietor
as M. López de Carrasquilla in 1689. She also lists an hacienda
Santiago in another chart on the same page (entitled "Las pequeñas
y medianas haciendas a fines del siglo XVII"), showing the proprietors
in 1670 as heirs to Gerónimo de Orozco (a BIG name in the area
at the time, founding family of Aguas.).  

She also includes an old map showing a Santiago as an "Azienda",
south of Pabellon & east of San Jose de Gracia

.
Deceo comprar este libre

.......by sheer coincidence I just received this message today:
Acá en Torreón, vive el señor Jose León Robles de la Torre que hizo 
algunas importantes investigaciones respecto a su familia en Tepetongo 
Zacatecas, Pienso que allí puede encontrar mucha información de la que 
usted necesita. 
  Deceo comprar  el libro de que Filigranas, Fundaciones y Genalogias, 
 que trae bastante genealogia de familias de por allá de Zacatecas, 
Tal vez el pueda darle alguna información a lo que usted busca. 
 
Si alquin is interesante por favor de e-mail me escriban a  
jsmunoz2781@... con prescio y donde llevendarlo.

Jose Munoz

I'm going to suspend the vote on members for the RSF because there are
only two people on the list of nominated and willing individuals.

We may need to forgo this project through lack of interest in how to
effectively distribute the funds once collected unless we can think of a
different system.

I'm open to suggestions.

joseph

Arturo,
   I would suggest if anyone hires him to do research
that he be paid by the job upon delivery. We know one
person whom hired him and prepaid for research and
never got any results over a year. 
    Then on the other hand we did get documentation
and paid him upon delivery. Anna was satisfied with
her results. I was not. 

Jose Munoz

--- Arturo Ramos  wrote:

> Leonardo de la Torre does NOT speak English.  I
> think that if I worked 
> out a deal with him, I would be willing to
> communicate project goals, 
> etc., to him for members who would sign up.  My
> Spanish is not perfect, 
> but I can hold my own.
> 
> When we were discussing my reimbursing his travel
> expenses for him to 
> come to Colotlan, he was adamant about getting the
> money wired to 
> him... he specifically did not want checks or money
> orders.
> 
> Since Paypal works more or less like a wire service
> once it is linked 
> to a bank account and they do allow linking to
> Mexican bank

I just want to mention that one of the people who attended our 
Sacramento gathering on Saturday has used Mr. de la Torre's 
services.  She said his rates were reasonable and he did provide hard 
copies of records, but that she already had much of the information 
he provided to her.  You might want to be very specific about what 
records you don't need him to research.  It did sound like he's a 
reputable researcher.

Maria

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos"  
wrote:
>
> I have already arranged to meet Mr. de la Torre in Colotlan along 
> with Esteban Valdes Salazar in a couple of weeks.
> 
> Mr. de la Torre has also suggested that we could purchase Jerez 
> information that he has already compiled from him and then it would 
> be ours to share among ourselves.  I dared not ask a price, as I 
> think that is going to be a delicate negotiation and it really 
> depends on what it is that he has.
> 
> He has mentioned that the Jerez parrish archves have

digest etiquette

whenever folks reply to a message that has come to them bundled in a
digest you can't just click on reply because then you will get the
"whole" reply message as part of your reply including the 17 other
messages you weren't replying to.

So instead just click reply and then cut or delete the parts that are
not about your reply and then put your response in. But DO leave in the
message you are replying about so we'll all know exactly what you are
are replying about.

ALSO as a message changes from one topic to another PLEASE change the
Subject line with the change in the message. That way we'll know what
each message is about.

so to recap:

1) if you get digest version don't just hit reply, but cut "out" the
other messages and only leave in the message you're replying to with
your response. From now on if anyone does this please forward me
examples and I'll email the "offender" privately and nicely "have a
little talk with them." I'm not on digest

Leonardo de la Torre does NOT speak English.  I think that if I worked 
out a deal with him, I would be willing to communicate project goals, 
etc., to him for members who would sign up.  My Spanish is not perfect, 
but I can hold my own.

When we were discussing my reimbursing his travel expenses for him to 
come to Colotlan, he was adamant about getting the money wired to 
him... he specifically did not want checks or money orders.

Since Paypal works more or less like a wire service once it is linked 
to a bank account and they do allow linking to Mexican bank accounts 
(it a bit slower since they have to make their money on the float), he 
may be amenable to that... depends on how much of a technophobe he is.  
However, I am sure that we can find a solution to this problem in one 
way or another.

I was thinking that what I would discuss with him was the possibility 
of working on an hourly basis with an ongoing list of projects... that 
way people could set out a budget for their

Hello:



Although I am very flattered I do not wish to be nominated.  I really think Kitty would do well.  However, I am here to help in anyway that I can; please let me know how.



Also, just want to add a little about the monthly 'stipend' on the man from Jerez.  He is a very good source.  I have talked to someone who is very well versed in research from Mexico and it was suggested that you be careful in a 'monthly stipend'.  It is better to order a specific job and get that done instead of a stipend. 



Mickey Garcia

Okay here are the people that have been nominated and who I will be
putting up for a vote. If anyone else is going to do some nominating I
need to know pretty soon. Also if anyone on this list would like to
withdraw their nomination let me know soon.

[no voting yet, you'll receive the voting in form of a "group poll."]

Mickey Garcia

Rosalinda Ruiz

Kitty Cortez


Also if any of those nominated would like to send in a paragraph or two with a description of why you would make a good committee member it would make it easier for the group to vote on you. I'm basing this on past polls and have the number of 10 votes to be elected into the committee. Later the committee can decide how to govern itself. I would like the committee to be a minimum of 3 people but would think it would be better with 5 members.

anyway if we can't find others to nominate we can go forward with a vote. If anyone really feels they would be a good committee member this would be a good time to speak up

I, too, would be interested in having someone in Mexico do some
research for me. But I have several questions. I am one of the list
members who does not speak Spanish. Does Senor de la Torre speak any
English? How would we communicate? I have names and dates for a
starting point. What else would he need. I have a Paypal account.
Can this be used to transfer money? I can pay, but not in the
hundreds each month. I will lurk a little longer on the list until
these and list member's other questions are asked.

Linda Romero

researching: Romero, de la Torre, Barba,

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Joseph Puentes  wrote:
> Arturo says he is going to talk more to el señor Leonardo de La Torre.
> 
> Ed Serros was in communication with him before. Ed, how was your experience?
> 
> joseph

Joseph,

I wrote to Arturo yesterday after he contacted me directly. See below. Please take into 
consideration that my personality is such that I tend to be distrustful and impatient.  
Anyway...


Arturo,

Yes, I have been in contact in the past with Leonardo de la Torre Berumen and with 
another researcher, Bernardo del Hoyos. The former is well-known and I have found many 
historical articles authored by him in the Jalisco/Zacatecas area of Mexico. Miguel 
Escobedo, an attorney from Mexico City, see http://www.noriegayescobedo.com.mx/
socios_escobedo.htm, has used both of these people and has spoken of them highly. 
Miguel's family were large land owners in Jalisco, e.g. Monte Escobedo is named after his 
ancestors. I fortuitously began to communicate

It just dawned on me the book is not written by Leonardo but by Jose 
Leon Robles de la Torre, they must be the same family?
Linda in Everett

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Erlinda Castanon-Long" 
 wrote:
>
> I forgot to mention the website under contruction where Mr.De La 
> Torre has where he freely shares information.  
> http://club.telepolis.com/letorre/archivo/introduccion1.htm
> Linda in Everett
> 
> --- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "rosa9972"  wrote:
> >
> > I would definitely be interested in this, since some information 
I 
> > need is unavailable, for the years I need are missing.  Count me 
> in 
> > on the contribution for his information.  What a great resource, 
> and 
> > thanks, Arturo, for contacting him.  
> >  
> > Great work!
> >  
> > Prima Rosalinda
> > 
> > 
> > --- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos" 
>  
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > I have already arranged to meet Mr. de la Torre in Colotlan 
> along 
>

What follows is Don Leonardo's webpage:
http://club.telepolis.com/jerz/index_archivos/marabr/index.htm

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" 
wrote:
>
> I am interested to know how computer-savvy Mr. De La Torre is as
regards doing genealogy research online.  He has an e-mail address, so
obviously he is computer-literate, but if I e-mailed him, would he
know what I was talking about if I mentioned the IGI, Ancestry.com,
World Connect, etc.?  Would he be able to scan and e-mail copies of
records and photos, or would he prefer snail-mail?   I cannot go to
Jerez, and all my communication with him would be via e-mail or
snail-mail, and I could send money to him from our local post office,
the way I see the green-carders here doing (sending money to Mexico).  
> 
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA ----

I forgot to mention the website under contruction where Mr.De La 
Torre has where he freely shares information.  
http://club.telepolis.com/letorre/archivo/introduccion1.htm
Linda in Everett

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "rosa9972"  wrote:
>
> I would definitely be interested in this, since some information I 
> need is unavailable, for the years I need are missing.  Count me 
in 
> on the contribution for his information.  What a great resource, 
and 
> thanks, Arturo, for contacting him.  
>  
> Great work!
>  
> Prima Rosalinda
> 
> 
> --- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos" 
 
> wrote:
> >
> > I have already arranged to meet Mr. de la Torre in Colotlan 
along 
> > with Esteban Valdes Salazar in a couple of weeks.
> > 
> > Mr. de la Torre has also suggested that we could purchase Jerez 
> > information that he has already compiled from him and then it 
> would 
> > be ours to share among ourselves.  I dared not ask a price, as I 
> >

A few years ago I purchased "Filigranas, Fundaciones Y Genealogias, 
Tepetongo, Zacs. by Mr Jose Jeon Robles de la Torre published in 
1999.  He includes in his book genealogy that is connected to him. 
He includes the De La Torre, Correa, Sanchez, Nava, Gonzales, 
Murillo, Carlos, Rodriguz, Mejia, Zuniga and Salazar lines. The book 
has more than 500 pages of information.  I was hoping to connect but 
found my Spanish just isn't good enough to read it... The man is 
obviously very well educated, a poet and very respected. I paid $90. 
for the book. If anyone is interested in buying it from me for what 
I paid I would be happy to pay the postage.  It should be with 
someone who can use it much better than I have.
Linda Castanon-Long in Everett Wa.

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "rosa9972"  wrote:
>
> I would definitely be interested in this, since some information I 
> need is unavailable, for the years I need are missing.  Count me 
in 
> on the contribution for his

I would definitely be interested in this, since some information I 
need is unavailable, for the years I need are missing.  Count me in 
on the contribution for his information.  What a great resource, and 
thanks, Arturo, for contacting him.  
 
Great work!
 
Prima Rosalinda


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos"  
wrote:
>
> I have already arranged to meet Mr. de la Torre in Colotlan along 
> with Esteban Valdes Salazar in a couple of weeks.
> 
> Mr. de la Torre has also suggested that we could purchase Jerez 
> information that he has already compiled from him and then it 
would 
> be ours to share among ourselves.  I dared not ask a price, as I 
> think that is going to be a delicate negotiation and it really 
> depends on what it is that he has.
> 
> He has mentioned that the Jerez parrish archves have confirmation 
> records and informacion matrimonial records for most of the years 
in 
> the 17th century where the baptism and marriage records are

I have already arranged to meet Mr. de la Torre in Colotlan along 
with Esteban Valdes Salazar in a couple of weeks.

Mr. de la Torre has also suggested that we could purchase Jerez 
information that he has already compiled from him and then it would 
be ours to share among ourselves.  I dared not ask a price, as I 
think that is going to be a delicate negotiation and it really 
depends on what it is that he has.

He has mentioned that the Jerez parrish archves have confirmation 
records and informacion matrimonial records for most of the years in 
the 17th century where the baptism and marriage records are missing.  
He also does a lot of research on protocolos from the Zacatecas state 
archives, which are not available on film.

Ed and I are definitely going to hire him.  He is very particular 
about getting paid up front and via wire transfer... This is not too 
big a deal if we collect money and pay him a monthly stipend, which 
is his suggestion.  I think it is a matter of making

Joseph; With enough interested parties, $100 may not be
necessary. I know a family that contributes $25 each to do their family line per
month. If there was a coordinated effort to line up all parties/surnames and
locations then it would be possible for the searcher